OPC Query

The way LTA enforce this law is that HDB car parks are considered as public car parks.


Watch out!!!!

crazyfox wrote:The way LTA enforce this law is that HDB car parks are considered as public car parks.


Watch out!!!!

That's what LTA told me, MSCP "roads" are public roads.... indirectly saying MSCP is also public car parks...

crazyfox wrote:The law is blind. The symbol of law, as I remembered it, is a statue with a person holding a scale balance and a sword. The person is also blindfolded.

so sad yet so true

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Justice

indeed blindfolded.. haix!

Dun need to argue so much on this topic until they change the rules. Previously my car forum guys one got warned on the driving in MSCP and the LTA biker warden actually touched the bonnet to see if warm or not.

Another guy witnessed a OPC WRX kenna in the car park. But kenna fine already too late even when he tore a fresh one on the spot. The time was 635 according to the forumer.

I'm not OPC but just a good will to fellow forumers dun sway sway kenna the fine it's super hard to appeal for OPC.

I have fine by LTA $200, and LTA officer told me that OPC not even to start engine or drive along the public area like car park or side lane, but if in your own big bungalow house garden and driveway will be no problem.

I advise all OPC owner do not drive within restricted times, if not will same like me donation to LTA, "I am lucky not go court and pay $200 only"

ok, LTA officer oso called me yesterday but was overseas didnt speak long to her.. i just came back n called her to discuss on the matter again.. conclusion is not new already.. so long u move ur vehicle u r violating the laws (darn stupid) but the officer agrees with me tat turning on engine but dun move ur car is fine.. i relate one of the case one bro mentioned abt warning or summon was given for turning on engine.. she was surprised the officer did tat.. she told me she will ask another senior person to speak to me n gather my feedback.. anyway, i told her i will write in to ST forum when im free cos i felt tat too many OPC owners dun knw abt MSCP considered as "public roads" and moving around ur carpark is not allowed.. i tried to convinced her tat "wat is the original intend/ basics/ principals of OPC scheme" she just repeating back to same answer mainly on the difficulities for the enforcers to determine if OPC driver did move the car anot.. i told her tat if LTA allow OPC cars to move within compound like carpark/ off road den the enforcer will just follow LTA rules... but she was like a machine like tat keep repeating the same answer (i guess she just follow was written on the book) anyway i have studied subject like traffic management etc in school.. to me the OPC scheme is merely a method used to ease congestion on the roads esp during peak hrs.. there is no logic abt this moving of cars within the carpark.. so long u r not on the road u dun contribute to the traffic volume.. the scheme will be effective.. i am very interested to hear what the higher management have to say abt this.. esp we are now on the transition period of a revamp scheme which is suppose to make OPC "atttractive"?! of cos we have to be prepared for the standard answer tat usage means moving of ur car be it carpark/ MSCP/ army camp compound..

for those who have been fined by turning on engine but not moving cars.. if necessary can give me ur particulars.. i will quote ur case when the senior LTA enforcer officer call me.. prepare bullets.. time for a war!

scorpey wrote:ok, LTA officer oso called me yesterday but was overseas didnt speak long to her.. i just came back n called her to discuss on the matter again.. conclusion is not new already.. so long u move ur vehicle u r violating the laws (darn stupid) but the officer agrees with me tat turning on engine but dun move ur car is fine.. i relate one of the case one bro mentioned abt warning or summon was given for turning on engine.. she was surprised the officer did tat.. she told me she will ask another senior person to speak to me n gather my feedback.. anyway, i told her i will write in to ST forum when im free cos i felt tat too many OPC owners dun knw abt MSCP considered as "public roads" and moving around ur carpark is not allowed.. i tried to convinced her tat "wat is the original intend/ basics/ principals of OPC scheme" she just repeating back to same answer mainly on the difficulities for the enforcers to determine if OPC driver did move the car anot.. i told her tat if LTA allow OPC cars to move within compound like carpark/ off road den the enforcer will just follow LTA rules... but she was like a machine like tat keep repeating the same answer (i guess she just follow was written on the book) anyway i have studied subject like traffic management etc in school.. to me the OPC scheme is merely a method used to ease congestion on the roads esp during peak hrs.. there is no logic abt this moving of cars within the carpark.. so long u r not on the road u dun contribute to the traffic volume.. the scheme will be effective.. i am very interested to hear what the higher management have to say abt this.. esp we are now on the transition period of a revamp scheme which is suppose to make OPC "atttractive"?! of cos we have to be prepared for the standard answer tat usage means moving of ur car be it carpark/ MSCP/ army camp compound..

Let's call for a petition and put our comments in all the newspapers.... (er... how to do ar?). I personally feel that like what bro Scorpey said, the intention of having an OPC scheme is to reduce congestion during peak hours. So moving the vehicle in MSCP, does it contribute to the congestion? At the first place, MSCP is not even congested. I believe the higher level officers should understand this just that the lower level people wanna CYA so they say what also cannot. If publicity of this is made in the newspaper, I believe we can get a clarification on this. If they say can't they should rationalise it, and not giving stupid reasons like the officer cannot ascertain if u drove out or what, if officer cannot c ur car on the road too bad la..

Any thoughts???

exactly, i keep telling her im not in for arguement but more on the logic n intend of the scheme.. but after a few standard replies i knew she is not the person for this discussion.. hv to draw media attention to "push" them for answer.. anyway i requested from her to officially reply my email n our conversation.. which by right will contain the confirmation tat turning on engine is ok.. so if there is a summon on opc turning on engine during restricted hours.. then the show begins.. im in for a petition thing too but dun knw how to start.. maybe attached the namelist together with an email to ST forum??

We need clarification on whether the driveway in the carpark is called a "road" in the definition. This is critical. If it is not a road in that sense, than whatever happen in the carpark is of no concern to LTA....and who is enforcing what....the driveway in carpark is under HDB management...what has that got to do with LTA who is managing public roads. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. Period.


By the way, carpark can be congested.....when a bobo driver tries to park into a lot....many times also cannot...panick somemore because many cars waiting to pass....er... I think that is congestion in the carpark.....haha....

But in this case, whether normal or OPC is not the problem. haha....



.

There are a few things i guess can be vague. i.e if an officer follow and OPC into a carpark and the car claims it was not driving outside just on the car for idling or to warm up engine. Unless the officer takes a pic while riding his bike there might be not way to prove he was driving vs in the middle of the road or expressway

Next, someone with intention to drive without a coupon on his engine and about to move LTA guys comes over. The driver can also claim he is not driving and subsequently just gave up driving tear a coupon then and then.

I guess for law biding people we will find it unfair but for such people, the rules are there for them.

ace wrote:We need clarification on whether the driveway in the carpark is called a "road" in the definition. This is critical. If it is not a road in that sense, than whatever happen in the carpark is of no concern to LTA....and who is enforcing what....the driveway in carpark is under HDB management...what has that got to do with LTA who is managing public roads. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. Period.


By the way, carpark can be congested.....when a bobo driver tries to park into a lot....many times also cannot...panick somemore because many cars waiting to pass....er... I think that is congestion in the carpark.....haha....

But in this case, whether normal or OPC is not the problem. haha.....

Bro, it should be road else what is it called? Car drives on road. I think the question is public car park or private carpark. i.e if OPC drives in a shopping mall carpark vs a HDB carpark.

To change the law, we need to get the The Legislature or lawmaker to do this. They are your President and Parliament. This means MP can raise the issue.

I believe a petition is needed to draw MP to this issue and they can make representation for us.

ace wrote:.............. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. .........

Well, I don't really agree coz in private Garmen don't own the land (well at least for 99 lease u lease the place)... MSCP is owned by Garmen... that's why they can do funny things, impose funny restrictions without thinking what's the main objective of having OPC scheme at the first place.

I have no idea how to start a petition but getting a written response from LTA is a good start and use that as an evidence to support our petition that LTA's stand is no movement of vehicle. From there we can then argue based on COMMON SENSE or LOGIC of the intention of OPC at the first place. I believe that whoever started the OPC thing do not intend to come out with this illogical idea of no movement of vehicle.

By the way, I thought OPC scheme mentioned about usage rather than roads?? (not sure about this, but I thought I saw it somewhere last time).

crazyfox wrote:To change the law, we need to get the The Legislature or lawmaker to do this. They are your President and Parliament. This means MP can raise the issue.

I believe a petition is needed to draw MP to this issue and they can make representation for us.

At the first place, is there a law that specifies clearly that you can't drive in MSCP? I personally don't think so. It's more of the interpretation of the words. So long as LTA makes it clear that you move within MSCP and don't hit the tar road or brick road or whatever they wanna call it, it should be ok right ?

kevinhwc wrote:

ace wrote:.............. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. .........

Well, I don't really agree coz in private Garmen don't own the land (well at least for 99 lease u lease the place)... MSCP is owned by Garmen... that's why they can do funny things, impose funny restrictions without thinking what's the main objective of having OPC scheme at the first place.

I have no idea how to start a petition but getting a written response from LTA is a good start and use that as an evidence to support our petition that LTA's stand is no movement of vehicle. From there we can then argue based on COMMON SENSE or LOGIC of the intention of OPC at the first place. I believe that whoever started the OPC thing do not intend to come out with this illogical idea of no movement of vehicle.

By the way, I thought OPC scheme mentioned about usage rather than roads?? (not sure about this, but I thought I saw it somewhere last time).

No offense but the discussion is it about turning on engine is an offense or not right? Got one question then, why would someone walk down from his house to carpark to on the engine then turn off again just to walk away. I guess if this question is answered easier to move forward. If i were LTA i will ask this question also. If answer is warm up engine, why not earlier in the day before and after the peak hours, die die must warm engine during the peak hours?

kevinhwc wrote:

crazyfox wrote:To change the law, we need to get the The Legislature or lawmaker to do this. They are your President and Parliament. This means MP can raise the issue.

I believe a petition is needed to draw MP to this issue and they can make representation for us.

At the first place, is there a law that specifies clearly that you can't drive in MSCP? I personally don't think so. It's more of the interpretation of the words. So long as LTA makes it clear that you move within MSCP and don't hit the tar road or brick road or whatever they wanna call it, it should be ok right ?

MSCP or open air carpark are both car parks, so what's the difference in this case? Just because my open air carpark is a tar i cannot drive in the carpark then another MSCP not tar they can drive. I'll be unhappy also if i park at open air. Then comes a question why want to drive in ur carpark -.-. OPC will say to wash car and such during peak hours so need to drive to washing bay. Sorry discuss halfway need to run off liao =x

aural wrote:

kevinhwc wrote:

ace wrote:.............. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. .........

Well, I don't really agree coz in private Garmen don't own the land (well at least for 99 lease u lease the place)... MSCP is owned by Garmen... that's why they can do funny things, impose funny restrictions without thinking what's the main objective of having OPC scheme at the first place.

I have no idea how to start a petition but getting a written response from LTA is a good start and use that as an evidence to support our petition that LTA's stand is no movement of vehicle. From there we can then argue based on COMMON SENSE or LOGIC of the intention of OPC at the first place. I believe that whoever started the OPC thing do not intend to come out with this illogical idea of no movement of vehicle.

By the way, I thought OPC scheme mentioned about usage rather than roads?? (not sure about this, but I thought I saw it somewhere last time).

No offense but the discussion is it about turning on engine is an offense or not right? Got one question then, why would someone walk down from his house to carpark to on the engine then turn off again just to walk away. I guess if this question is answered easier to move forward. If i were LTA i will ask this question also. If answer is warm up engine, why not earlier in the day before and after the peak hours, die die must warm engine during the peak hours?

Bro,
Maybe someone just want to warm up the engine? Left the car for 3 weeks and he went overseas? Possible also. If you are on leave, who on earth want to wake up at 6+ am to warm up the car? Or after peak probably if he flying off at 5pm that day? Who knows.. coincidence....

But I though bro Scorpey said that the LTA officer confirmed with him that starting engine is not an offence but driving within MSCP is an offence ?

aural wrote:

kevinhwc wrote:

ace wrote:.............. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. .........

Well, I don't really agree coz in private Garmen don't own the land (well at least for 99 lease u lease the place)... MSCP is owned by Garmen... that's why they can do funny things, impose funny restrictions without thinking what's the main objective of having OPC scheme at the first place.

I have no idea how to start a petition but getting a written response from LTA is a good start and use that as an evidence to support our petition that LTA's stand is no movement of vehicle. From there we can then argue based on COMMON SENSE or LOGIC of the intention of OPC at the first place. I believe that whoever started the OPC thing do not intend to come out with this illogical idea of no movement of vehicle.

By the way, I thought OPC scheme mentioned about usage rather than roads?? (not sure about this, but I thought I saw it somewhere last time).

No offense but the discussion is it about turning on engine is an offense or not right? Got one question then, why would someone walk down from his house to carpark to on the engine then turn off again just to walk away. I guess if this question is answered easier to move forward. If i were LTA i will ask this question also. If answer is warm up engine, why not earlier in the day before and after the peak hours, die die must warm engine during the peak hours?

You have used your car on a public carpark. Based on this an offence is committed. Even pushing your OPC is an offence. To book you or not, is strictly on whether officer show mercy.

This is where I think the law and intent of law has a disparity.

from wad i see, the days of tearing coupon r going to be history soon, so it is very easy for enforcers to see if the car really go onto public roads a not.. if u go to the roads, he need no even need to come n speak to u.. just check over the system if u buy e-coupon n tats it.. so the crucial issue is really, driving within the compound like carpark/ MSCP/ non-public road is an offence? since opc scheme is established n managed by LTA, LTA will be the "King" to define what is a road.. and wad im trying to prove is tat this "carpark road" shouldn't be the intention of the entire scheme in the first place..

aural wrote:

kevinhwc wrote:

crazyfox wrote:To change the law, we need to get the The Legislature or lawmaker to do this. They are your President and Parliament. This means MP can raise the issue.

I believe a petition is needed to draw MP to this issue and they can make representation for us.

At the first place, is there a law that specifies clearly that you can't drive in MSCP? I personally don't think so. It's more of the interpretation of the words. So long as LTA makes it clear that you move within MSCP and don't hit the tar road or brick road or whatever they wanna call it, it should be ok right ?

MSCP or open air carpark are both car parks, so what's the difference in this case? Just because my open air carpark is a tar i cannot drive in the carpark then another MSCP not tar they can drive. I'll be unhappy also if i park at open air. Then comes a question why want to drive in ur carpark -.-. OPC will say to wash car and such during peak hours so need to drive to washing bay. Sorry discuss halfway need to run off liao =x

I know nuts about Sg laws. I thought MSCP cannot wash car anyhow have to go to washing bay (if u use a lot of water, unlike the banglah)? Open car park can or not arh? Coz if moving the car in MSCP other than to washing bay, I cannot think of why wanna move car, unless someone say, i found my lucky parking spot .

scorpey wrote:from wad i see, the days of tearing coupon r going to be history soon, so it is very easy for enforcers to see if the car really go onto public roads a not.. if u go to the roads, he need no even need to come n speak to u.. just check over the system if u buy e-coupon n tats it.. so the crucial issue is really, driving within the compound like carpark/ MSCP/ non-public road is an offence? since opc scheme is established n managed by LTA, LTA will be the "King" to define what is a road.. and wad im trying to prove is tat this "carpark road" shouldn't be the intention of the entire scheme in the first place..

+1

Coz I really cannot understand the rationale behind that. Moving a car to washing bay is an offence? I am not there to create a congestion (which is the original intention of having an OPC).

B4 i bought OPC there were many told me that OPC got many problems, to be stopped by TP everytime u drive during restricted hours, etc... but to think of it, if we are diligent enough and follow the rules, probably will have less issues...

In the future, it might be easier for them to track our car location. if not why do they remove the coupon scheme and use online application? How would they know if we have drivien? Somemore we are given up to the next day 12pm to apply for the licence to drive during restricted hours. paperless also mean : "i know u drive your OPC

OPC = 2nd class car owner

i dun knw abt the rest, i do turn on engine just to warm it up cos sometime i travel n the car will be there for quite sometime.. and i used to shift around my open carpark for 4 gd yrs not knowing it was an offence.. reason for shifting? get a better lot, away from bird ****, heavy vehicle, 101 reasons ya? now im in MSCP, i will shift to get a car wash at the washing bay... can u guys imagine u can't do this during restricted hrs n maybe u r on leave? who will pay $20 jus to shift ur car for a car wash!? doesn't make sense right? the LTA officer also told me a guy always got problem getting a carpark lot at his place cos he returns late at night due to work.. den sometime he has to illegal park inside his carpark.. he normally will shift during restricted hours after ppl going 4 work.. so there u are..another reason why u need to shift ur car during restricted hours.. yes, verbally i got from the officer is turning engine is ok but not moving ur a** around

I think other reason is we OPC owners have 17K outfront rebat, so sometime we need to pay back --- ??

htp223 wrote:

B4 i bought OPC there were many told me that OPC got many problems, to be stopped by TP everytime u drive during restricted hours, etc... but to think of it, if we are diligent enough and follow the rules, probably will have less issues...

In the future, it might be easier for them to track our car location. if not why do they remove the coupon scheme and use online application? How would they know if we have drivien? Somemore we are given up to the next day 12pm to apply for the licence to drive during restricted hours. paperless also mean : "i know u drive your OPC

OPC = 2nd class car owner

ok i think i knw the answer to ur que.. to knw why paperless.. u hv to knw there r more n more cars on the road.. LTA tries hard on ways to reduce cars from the roads.. ERP, more roads built, encouraging Public transport, park n ride, last but no least opc.. opc has been on an increasing trend.. hence, if more normal cars go for opc.. that will reduce congestion as well.. so how to encourage normal plate to opc? u gotto make opc more attractive.. to make it more attractive? Da Ta~~ E-coupon!! Sats can drive etc etc.. so the idea is to make u switch to this scheme n ease congestion on roads.. the idea here is not really to track u.. can u imagine how much manpower n technology gotto invested in to track all opcs?? it is really to make normal plate cars to join in the "dun drive during peak hour please" group..

To address ur first pt, Opc is not as problematic as u were told.. i have driven opc for 5 years and only stopped n checked once by TP during peak hr, in future i dun thk they stop u at all.. and why feel 2nd class? im sure u see sports cars, luxury car with red plate too right?

kevinhwc wrote:

aural wrote:

kevinhwc wrote:

ace wrote:.............. If driving in the carpark during restricted hours is an offence, than all driving in all carpark whether private carpark or public carpark is an offence. .........

Well, I don't really agree coz in private Garmen don't own the land (well at least for 99 lease u lease the place)... MSCP is owned by Garmen... that's why they can do funny things, impose funny restrictions without thinking what's the main objective of having OPC scheme at the first place.

I have no idea how to start a petition but getting a written response from LTA is a good start and use that as an evidence to support our petition that LTA's stand is no movement of vehicle. From there we can then argue based on COMMON SENSE or LOGIC of the intention of OPC at the first place. I believe that whoever started the OPC thing do not intend to come out with this illogical idea of no movement of vehicle.

By the way, I thought OPC scheme mentioned about usage rather than roads?? (not sure about this, but I thought I saw it somewhere last time).

No offense but the discussion is it about turning on engine is an offense or not right? Got one question then, why would someone walk down from his house to carpark to on the engine then turn off again just to walk away. I guess if this question is answered easier to move forward. If i were LTA i will ask this question also. If answer is warm up engine, why not earlier in the day before and after the peak hours, die die must warm engine during the peak hours?

Bro,
Maybe someone just want to warm up the engine? Left the car for 3 weeks and he went overseas? Possible also. If you are on leave, who on earth want to wake up at 6+ am to warm up the car? Or after peak probably if he flying off at 5pm that day? Who knows.. coincidence....

But I though bro Scorpey said that the LTA officer confirmed with him that starting engine is not an offence but driving within MSCP is an offence ?

Yah of course this is possible, rare though and setting a rule for a rare occurence not high chance also. But according to scorpey its not exactly black and white and the officer's answer is apparently not very convincing. I guess better to get black and white like scorpey mentioned to protect ourselves.

scorpey wrote:i dun knw abt the rest, i do turn on engine just to warm it up cos sometime i travel n the car will be there for quite sometime.. and i used to shift around my open carpark for 4 gd yrs not knowing it was an offence.. reason for shifting? get a better lot, away from bird ****, heavy vehicle, 101 reasons ya? now im in MSCP, i will shift to get a car wash at the washing bay... can u guys imagine u can't do this during restricted hrs n maybe u r on leave? who will pay $20 jus to shift ur car for a car wash!? doesn't make sense right? the LTA officer also told me a guy always got problem getting a carpark lot at his place cos he returns late at night due to work.. den sometime he has to illegal park inside his carpark.. he normally will shift during restricted hours after ppl going 4 work.. so there u are..another reason why u need to shift ur car during restricted hours.. yes, verbally i got from the officer is turning engine is ok but not moving ur a** around

Agree with the shifting cars to non **** area for open air. I guess this part like no answer unless all carparks they put it as non-road usage?

scorpey wrote:

htp223 wrote:

B4 i bought OPC there were many told me that OPC got many problems, to be stopped by TP everytime u drive during restricted hours, etc... but to think of it, if we are diligent enough and follow the rules, probably will have less issues...

In the future, it might be easier for them to track our car location. if not why do they remove the coupon scheme and use online application? How would they know if we have drivien? Somemore we are given up to the next day 12pm to apply for the licence to drive during restricted hours. paperless also mean : "i know u drive your OPC

OPC = 2nd class car owner

ok i think i knw the answer to ur que.. to knw why paperless.. u hv to knw there r more n more cars on the road.. LTA tries hard on ways to reduce cars from the roads.. ERP, more roads built, encouraging Public transport, park n ride, last but no least opc.. opc has been on an increasing trend.. hence, if more normal cars go for opc.. that will reduce congestion as well.. so how to encourage normal plate to opc? u gotto make opc more attractive.. to make it more attractive? Da Ta~~ E-coupon!! Sats can drive etc etc.. so the idea is to make u switch to this scheme n ease congestion on roads.. the idea here is not really to track u.. can u imagine how much manpower n technology gotto invested in to track all opcs?? it is really to make normal plate cars to join in the "dun drive during peak hour please" group..

To address ur first pt, Opc is not as problematic as u were told.. i have driven opc for 5 years and only stopped n checked once by TP during peak hr, in future i dun thk they stop u at all.. and why feel 2nd class? im sure u see sports cars, luxury car with red plate too right?

Dun think OPC = 2nd class lah. Just that you know the rules of OPC when you buy, if need to use tear a coupon. You use the coupon no one can stop u, so where comes the 2nd class part. Making OPC more attractive may just reduce slightly more care during peak hours but of course not always effective. In fact i think those who buy OPC and tear during normal hours are good people, they know their usage and buy OPC to reduce both cost and cars on normal road. Pay 20 bucks to use only when they need. Like i said good people with good planning.

i cant really think out of the box...can we really use "LOGIC" and argue so that we can drive in MSCP or open carpark?
its up to them to accecpt our reasons... even they accept and re-write the rules, 99% of us guai guai follow and dun be creative, there will always b 1% who may think otherwise. It happens everywhere...

Shaq wrote:i cant really think out of the box...can we really use "LOGIC" and argue so that we can drive in MSCP or open carpark?
its up to them to accecpt our reasons... even they accept and re-write the rules, 99% of us guai guai follow and dun be creative, there will always b 1% who may think otherwise. It happens everywhere...

If we are serious about it. Have to take some thought process and tons of feedback from everyone from both OPC and non OPC drivers' perspective too. Of course also can cut short the process by going to other older forums to get info that has been discussed before.

aural wrote:

scorpey wrote:

htp223 wrote:

B4 i bought OPC there were many told me that OPC got many problems, to be stopped by TP everytime u drive during restricted hours, etc... but to think of it, if we are diligent enough and follow the rules, probably will have less issues...

In the future, it might be easier for them to track our car location. if not why do they remove the coupon scheme and use online application? How would they know if we have drivien? Somemore we are given up to the next day 12pm to apply for the licence to drive during restricted hours. paperless also mean : "i know u drive your OPC

OPC = 2nd class car owner

ok i think i knw the answer to ur que.. to knw why paperless.. u hv to knw there r more n more cars on the road.. LTA tries hard on ways to reduce cars from the roads.. ERP, more roads built, encouraging Public transport, park n ride, last but no least opc.. opc has been on an increasing trend.. hence, if more normal cars go for opc.. that will reduce congestion as well.. so how to encourage normal plate to opc? u gotto make opc more attractive.. to make it more attractive? Da Ta~~ E-coupon!! Sats can drive etc etc.. so the idea is to make u switch to this scheme n ease congestion on roads.. the idea here is not really to track u.. can u imagine how much manpower n technology gotto invested in to track all opcs?? it is really to make normal plate cars to join in the "dun drive during peak hour please" group..

To address ur first pt, Opc is not as problematic as u were told.. i have driven opc for 5 years and only stopped n checked once by TP during peak hr, in future i dun thk they stop u at all.. and why feel 2nd class? im sure u see sports cars, luxury car with red plate too right?

Dun think OPC = 2nd class lah. Just that you know the rules of OPC when you buy, if need to use tear a coupon. You use the coupon no one can stop u, so where comes the 2nd class part. Making OPC more attractive may just reduce slightly more care during peak hours but of course not always effective. In fact i think those who buy OPC and tear during normal hours are good people, they know their usage and buy OPC to reduce both cost and cars on normal road. Pay 20 bucks to use only when they need. Like i said good people with good planning.

I have been driving OPC coz of lifestyle...

Parking in CBD damn ex and I usually reach home after 7pm. So weekend are the times when I really use the car.

For those exceptional days like anniversary etc, then pay and put coupon loh...

In the long run, I still save and get to use the card along with my usage mode..

as discussed....OPC is a choice.... a lifestyle choice...if i knew that i would be in the office by 7:30am and leave after 8pm, i may have opted for opc as well...then i can have more budget for poisons...

JuanST wrote:as discussed....OPC is a choice.... a lifestyle choice...if i knew that i would be in the office by 7:30am and leave after 8pm, i may have opted for opc as well...then i can have more budget for poisons...

Anyway i did my math with a client, OPC rebate 17k = 850 coupons. If you need to tear 2 tickets a week. The 17k can last you 8.5 years. 4 tickets a week can last u 4.25yrs. End up he no take OPC, lol cos he dun want to be bothered with the tickets and he most likely need to drive before 8pm at least 3 times a week.

aural wrote:

JuanST wrote:as discussed....OPC is a choice.... a lifestyle choice...if i knew that i would be in the office by 7:30am and leave after 8pm, i may have opted for opc as well...then i can have more budget for poisons...

Anyway i did my math with a client, OPC rebate 17k = 850 coupons. If you need to tear 2 tickets a week. The 17k can last you 8.5 years. 4 tickets a week can last u 4.25yrs. End up he no take OPC, lol cos he dun want to be bothered with the tickets and he most likely need to drive before 8pm at least 3 times a week.

The way you put it is naturally making people don't want OPC, because can never break even. It has to fit your lifestyle first, for example asking whether the person drives to work or not and whether he needs to move around during working hours. For me both are no, then I start to think whether I want the freedom to use the car removed for a 17k compensation. And I calculated that with the reduction in road tax, it should already be a good compensation and the 17k is for keeps.

Owning a car is a nuisance hor... wash car also control. I think I committed offense many times already driving my car from MSCP to my block to load the baby stroller and people before leaving at 3pm/7pm on the dot. Who the hell did I congest by going from MSCP to block? ****!

liplip wrote:

aural wrote:

JuanST wrote:as discussed....OPC is a choice.... a lifestyle choice...if i knew that i would be in the office by 7:30am and leave after 8pm, i may have opted for opc as well...then i can have more budget for poisons...

Anyway i did my math with a client, OPC rebate 17k = 850 coupons. If you need to tear 2 tickets a week. The 17k can last you 8.5 years. 4 tickets a week can last u 4.25yrs. End up he no take OPC, lol cos he dun want to be bothered with the tickets and he most likely need to drive before 8pm at least 3 times a week.

The way you put it is naturally making people don't want OPC, because can never break even. It has to fit your lifestyle first, for example asking whether the person drives to work or not and whether he needs to move around during working hours. For me both are no, then I start to think whether I want the freedom to use the car removed for a 17k compensation. And I calculated that with the reduction in road tax, it should already be a good compensation and the 17k is for keeps.

No lah, my friend is calculating the least usage already possible for him and it does not make sense mathematically. Like you said it depends on lifestyle, for him it does not work out. Even with one week tear 2 for light usage can last 8.5yrs. Frankly not many OPC drivers i know tear that many tickets a week and also very few people even keep cars beyond 5 years. If someone drives mainly off peak the 17k rebate is substantial and well recieved by them.

It's a great system!

I ride my bike to work... get home around 615-630... take a shower... Juz nice.

If you take loan with $17k, based on current interest of 2.2% over 10 years, the amount would be $20,740.

The number of coupons would be 1037 over 10 years.
Per year would be abt 103.
Per month would be abt 8.

So if you drive every sat, you still have one day per week to tear a coupon.

BUT WAHING CAR and TEAR A COUPON IN YOUR OWN MSCP, IT IS RIDICULOUS.

I think if someone have cash on hand they can register as nor car, after that conver to OPC ($100 one time payment), and after next year January LTA will pay $2200/per every year back to the owner, compare with the $1700/ per year compensation ($17000/10), you make $500=25 coupon per year, is it better - due to low bank interest rate.

you also gain the first payment rood tax from CNC, $369-$50=$319, because when you register as OPC, CNC do not rebat you the difference, only Toyata rebat you in new car market

kevinhwc wrote:

scorpey wrote:ok, LTA officer oso called me yesterday but was overseas didnt speak long to her.. i just came back n called her to discuss on the matter again.. conclusion is not new already.. so long u move ur vehicle u r violating the laws (darn stupid) but the officer agrees with me tat turning on engine but dun move ur car is fine.. i relate one of the case one bro mentioned abt warning or summon was given for turning on engine.. she was surprised the officer did tat.. she told me she will ask another senior person to speak to me n gather my feedback.. anyway, i told her i will write in to ST forum when im free cos i felt tat too many OPC owners dun knw abt MSCP considered as "public roads" and moving around ur carpark is not allowed.. i tried to convinced her tat "wat is the original intend/ basics/ principals of OPC scheme" she just repeating back to same answer mainly on the difficulities for the enforcers to determine if OPC driver did move the car anot.. i told her tat if LTA allow OPC cars to move within compound like carpark/ off road den the enforcer will just follow LTA rules... but she was like a machine like tat keep repeating the same answer (i guess she just follow was written on the book) anyway i have studied subject like traffic management etc in school.. to me the OPC scheme is merely a method used to ease congestion on the roads esp during peak hrs.. there is no logic abt this moving of cars within the carpark.. so long u r not on the road u dun contribute to the traffic volume.. the scheme will be effective.. i am very interested to hear what the higher management have to say abt this.. esp we are now on the transition period of a revamp scheme which is suppose to make OPC "atttractive"?! of cos we have to be prepared for the standard answer tat usage means moving of ur car be it carpark/ MSCP/ army camp compound..

Let's call for a petition and put our comments in all the newspapers.... (er... how to do ar?). I personally feel that like what bro Scorpey said, the intention of having an OPC scheme is to reduce congestion during peak hours. So moving the vehicle in MSCP, does it contribute to the congestion? At the first place, MSCP is not even congested. I believe the higher level officers should understand this just that the lower level people wanna CYA so they say what also cannot. If publicity of this is made in the newspaper, I believe we can get a clarification on this. If they say can't they should rationalise it, and not giving stupid reasons like the officer cannot ascertain if u drove out or what, if officer cannot c ur car on the road too bad la..

Any thoughts???

+1 for all opc owners..

kevinhwc wrote:

scorpey wrote:ok, LTA officer oso called me yesterday but was overseas didnt speak long to her.. i just came back n called her to discuss on the matter again.. conclusion is not new already.. so long u move ur vehicle u r violating the laws (darn stupid) but the officer agrees with me tat turning on engine but dun move ur car is fine.. i relate one of the case one bro mentioned abt warning or summon was given for turning on engine.. she was surprised the officer did tat.. she told me she will ask another senior person to speak to me n gather my feedback.. anyway, i told her i will write in to ST forum when im free cos i felt tat too many OPC owners dun knw abt MSCP considered as "public roads" and moving around ur carpark is not allowed.. i tried to convinced her tat "wat is the original intend/ basics/ principals of OPC scheme" she just repeating back to same answer mainly on the difficulities for the enforcers to determine if OPC driver did move the car anot.. i told her tat if LTA allow OPC cars to move within compound like carpark/ off road den the enforcer will just follow LTA rules... but she was like a machine like tat keep repeating the same answer (i guess she just follow was written on the book) anyway i have studied subject like traffic management etc in school.. to me the OPC scheme is merely a method used to ease congestion on the roads esp during peak hrs.. there is no logic abt this moving of cars within the carpark.. so long u r not on the road u dun contribute to the traffic volume.. the scheme will be effective.. i am very interested to hear what the higher management have to say abt this.. esp we are now on the transition period of a revamp scheme which is suppose to make OPC "atttractive"?! of cos we have to be prepared for the standard answer tat usage means moving of ur car be it carpark/ MSCP/ army camp compound..

Let's call for a petition and put our comments in all the newspapers.... (er... how to do ar?). I personally feel that like what bro Scorpey said, the intention of having an OPC scheme is to reduce congestion during peak hours. So moving the vehicle in MSCP, does it contribute to the congestion? At the first place, MSCP is not even congested. I believe the higher level officers should understand this just that the lower level people wanna CYA so they say what also cannot. If publicity of this is made in the newspaper, I believe we can get a clarification on this. If they say can't they should rationalise it, and not giving stupid reasons like the officer cannot ascertain if u drove out or what, if officer cannot c ur car on the road too bad la..

Any thoughts???

For sure I believe there will be many supporters... but who is gonna start this??

and

How??

Petition?

Writing into Forums?

Talking to MP session?

STOMP??

You cant talk to LTA officer, they enforce the law. They cant change it.

You need a MP to campaign for this.

If you want to use new media, can start a threat in stomp and everyone post their unhappiness on it.

Then go to LTA website and reflect your opinion to the authority in the feedback form.

Lastly, .... go to the opposition.

MSCP as public roads????? later they put ERP gantries inside the MSCP... then how?

LTA senior person has not call me yet.. and i quite busy to shoot letter to ST forum.. will do it when im free ya?

JuanST wrote:MSCP as public roads????? later they put ERP gantries inside the MSCP... then how?

must have proper pedestrian lanes oso... else we gonna get fined for jaywalking?

crazyfox wrote:You cant talk to LTA officer, they enforce the law. They cant change it.

You need a MP to campaign for this.

If you want to use new media, can start a threat in stomp and everyone post their unhappiness on it.

Then go to LTA website and reflect your opinion to the authority in the feedback form.

Lastly, .... go to the opposition.

open a thread in HWZ - EDMW... seems like quit alot of reporters visit that forum also..

tell u guys what, there are 2 ways.

1. ask LTA repair ur HDB carpark road, say a big pothole is there, hear what they say, maybe later they say it belongs to HDB. if that is the case, then driving around ur carpark should by right be ok.

but first, we would need to find a carpark that is badly damage.

2. Go to talk to MP, i think election coming. so this should work too and discussed in parliment.

Anyone living in East coast GRC, that way faster.

The ownership and management of a piece of property does not affect the application of law. Based on its definition, it can decide to encoached itself even in the case of private property.

Example:- The case where a private properties need to seek permission to chop down his own tree even in his own backyard in Bukit Timah because it is a designated protected zone.

ermm ok go for option 2, should be faster.
haha